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Sonder - UK Categorization Onboarding - 2024-10-01

Metadata

  • Date: 2024-10-01
  • Company: Sonder
  • External Participants: Erik Alvarez (Treasury)
  • Palm Participants: Gurjit Pannu, Christian Sobkowski
  • Type: Customer Call
  • Domain Areas: Categorization, Reporting, Cash forecasting
  • Recording: https://tldv.io/app/meetings/66fc0e9abed2d10013d97da1

Summary

Context

Customer onboarding session focused on categorization strategy for Sonder's UK accounts. Christian walked Erik through Palm's LLM-based categorization approach, discussing how to balance Treasury's need for high-level categories with downstream teams' need for granular reporting. The goal was to align on categories that enable better forecasting, variance analysis, and storytelling with Treasury data.

Key Discussion Points

  • Sonder has 158 budget codes in Kyriba - too granular for Treasury use but needed for AR/AP teams
  • Collections: Treasury wants 4-5 high-level categories (Airbnb, Stripe, Booking, Corp Accounts) vs. vendor-level detail for AR
  • Airbnb complexity: Each city has its own Airbnb account (~35 accounts), creating 40+ budget codes just for Airbnb collections
  • Rent payments currently staggered due to landlord negotiations, making prepaid rent identification manual
  • Intercompany transactions (loans, settlements, cost plus) can be consolidated into single "Intercompany" category
  • UK accounts: 92% of volume covered by ~13 categories
  • Palm uses LLM-based categorization instead of rule-based mapping

Pain Points

  • Too many granular budget codes create clutter in dashboards and charts
  • Manual work to identify prepaid rent vs regular rent (no rules, just timing-based)
  • Creating one-off budget codes that rarely get used ("pet peeve")
  • Spending 30 minutes on weekly reports nobody reads or responds to
  • OTA fees (booking.com commissions) hard to identify from batch payments in NetSuite
  • Wire payments don't show what they're for - have to manually look up batch numbers
  • Team turnover means institutional knowledge gets lost, leading to more granular codes

Feature Requests & Needs

  • Treasury-level categories (5-10) for forecasting and dashboards
  • Granular vendor tags for downstream reporting (without cluttering Treasury views)
  • Ability to identify prepaid rent automatically based on payment timing
  • Better OTA fee tracking (chargebacks vs commissions vs processing fees)

Jobs & Desired Outcomes

Job: Tell stories with Treasury data using categories

Desired Outcomes: - Minimize the number of categories to reduce chart/report clutter - Increase the ability to forecast accurately by category type - Reduce mental maintenance when new suppliers/vendors are added

Job: Support downstream teams (AR, AP) with transaction identification

Desired Outcomes: - Minimize the time AR team spends identifying specific deposits by vendor/city - Reduce the frequency of questions like "why didn't this budget code show up?" - Increase accuracy of journal entries created from Treasury reports

Domain Insights

  • Budget code hierarchy: Sonder uses grouping codes (parent categories) with granular codes underneath - Treasury wants to see grouping level, AR/AP needs granular
  • OTA structure: Airbnb not designed for multi-property businesses - requires separate account per city
  • Rent timing: Traditionally paid 1st-10th of month; now staggered due to landlord negotiations
  • Cost plus: Transfer pricing settlements from tax team, treated same as intercompany transfers
  • Chargebacks vs OTA fees: Booking.com fees include both commissions and chargebacks - better term might be "OTA fees"

Action Items

  • [ ] Palm to run categorization model on UK accounts (blind test without Kyriba budget codes)
  • [ ] Erik to think about whether intercompany loans need separate tracking or can be grouped
  • [ ] Palm to provide report showing matches/mismatches in 2 weeks
  • [ ] Erik to update on HSBC signatories (directors approved)

Notable Quotes

"On a Treasury level, all I want to see is collections. What's your overall collections? But I think we're doing this for our other AP AR teams where it's easier for them to identify or create journal entries." - Erik Alvarez

"You start sending weekly emails with some updates... you haven't heard anything for two months, like oh, spending 30 minutes out of my life doing a report that nobody looks, nobody cares about." - Erik Alvarez

"I don't want to create a one-off budget code. It's a pet peeve of mine." - Erik Alvarez

"These categories should be able to help you tell stories about your data. But at the same time, they should be high level enough so that they are not cluttering up every chart." - Christian Sobkowski

Full Transcript

00:02 Gurjit Pannu: we'd love to kind of share with you and hear your thoughts on and then we have some kind of open questions. What we want to do with all of, this is take this information from you and start automating how we categorize And then also share some some ideas around how we can get to your your transactions on those UK accounts, especially when HSBC such coming in.

00:16 Gurjit Pannu: And so this is kind of the ultimate goal of what you're trying to achieve with with great mapping rules and budget codes. first step towards that. Yeah, sort of the excited for the session. So this exercise Christian will drive it. He'll give you a bit of an overview around, what we've seen from your account.

00:22 Gurjit Pannu: And what, the activity that we've seen across your, the UK cats that

00:22 Erik Alvarez: Awesome. Yeah.

00:24 Gurjit Pannu: Do you have any questions before we kick in kick off?

00:27 Erik Alvarez: No, nothing on my own.

00:30 Gurjit Pannu: Cool. Christian over to you.

00:33 Christian Sobkowski: Okay, and let's go. And let's Hey, and Erik. So, so what. So, the way we usually do these things is it's a bit of like Proper the proper onboarding to to the platform where I think you've heard Gucci, talk about these categories for a while. It's it underpins a bit of everything in some ways, it drives a lot of different things in the platform and also for you as business.

01:06 Christian Sobkowski: So this is very much about this session is now walk through what, what we're doing in a second, but in. The idea is that in the next, say, two weeks, or so, we're actually putting what we discuss here in the session. Bye for the platform for you. And you're seeing the Probably slightly new set of categories, run through the platform.

01:27 Christian Sobkowski: Sounds good.

01:29 Erik Alvarez: Gotcha. Yep.

01:33 Christian Sobkowski: I'll quickly tell you what, what? you prepared and what I want to go through and I want to talk about sort of a global Strategy, Almost strategy behind categories for you. Right. What is it that you're trying to accomplish with? and then specifically the areas I want to talk about this sort of So, Called visibility.

01:58 Christian Sobkowski: But right, what happened across your accounts and for you to be able to understand what happened. The forecasting bit, what is going to happen, and we're right categories, drive a lot of forecasting and then underpinning it all your reporting. And and really, I want to, I want to talk a bit around how we've seen categories work best.

02:22 Christian Sobkowski: And sort of have a bit, we've prepared a bit of a gap in all of this too to what you have with Kariba right now. So that's one thing, global strategy briefly and then I want to, I want to go through the UK account specifically when it goes through the context on everything else flow so far and figure.

02:41 Christian Sobkowski: And What, what activity do we have? What context do we want to give the model? And how do we categorize? Okay.

02:51 Erik Alvarez: Mm-hmm. Gotcha.

02:54 Christian Sobkowski: so ultimately alignment on what our character, the categories and then The What's happening in the UK? Comes that we should code into Paul, okay?

03:04 Erik Alvarez: Cool.

03:09 Christian Sobkowski: I'll die for it and then What? I'll quickly into into how how we're using these categories. We've. What we've seen work best, is we really use these things? As almost the overarching, way to tell stories with your Treasury data. And right where you've we've. We've had sessions where we're talking about your rent payments.

03:45 Christian Sobkowski: We've had sessions, we will talk about your collections activity. And it's really. So, every, every These categories should be able to help you tell stories about your data. But at the same time, there should be high level enough, so that they are not cluttering up every chart, every, every report that you have, because ultimately, if you, if you start having too many, you might as well just have the road transactions because you're having right, you're it just all noisy and so it's about finding that right level.

04:24 Christian Sobkowski: And then sort of, right? Ultimately you you want low mental maintenance of these things because whenever you have a start having a new supplier, you don't want to build a new rule for that supplier. Ideally just goes into whatever bucket you for reset up. You and and right, you want to have accuracy across C Rows categories.

04:48 Christian Sobkowski: And we use. I'm sure. Could you talked about it instead of rule-based? We use Llms for the categorization, so that I think we showed you. The next example, sort of that, you don't have to worry about these things. Here's what what you currently have. What you currently. So sort of on a global basis, you you shared your 158 total categories, you have coded in Kariba right now with us.

05:25 Christian Sobkowski: where I think you're I I saw your decommissioning, a couple of them, bringing it down to fully what one once earliest something got Which is a bit more than we typically see. Best used to reduce clutter and this is probably the bit where I would love to on a global strategic level, have the biggest discussion with you about today, around What are you using them for? And is it, is it in your In your best interest to reduce number of categories, down to, basically be better at forecasting to be better at storytelling about the data to be better at important.

06:12 Christian Sobkowski: Um and then you you have the transaction types which is like operating on operating flows and income outcome, which is pretty aligned with how how is coded into our system already. Let's start there. And I would love to hear sort of ask us, right? You you set this up in Kariba you're using them day to day.

06:39 Christian Sobkowski: Are they useful? Are they granular enough? Are they too granular?

06:46 Erik Alvarez: On some occasions, they need to be granular.

06:51 Christian Sobkowski: Yeah.

06:52 Erik Alvarez: And I know most There's a lot I think I mentioned to Gurjit last week. For Airbnb. For instance, I believe we have like revolving around Airbnb. 50. Maybe I'll say around 40, just

07:10 Christian Sobkowski: Yep.

07:10 Erik Alvarez: In an ideal world. We would just want to see airbnb. That's it, right? It's collections all urban B. Because in airbnb, we are set up where each property or each city has its own airbnb account, right? Airbnb is set up for your Airbnb is set up for your local.

07:32 Erik Alvarez: The four of us were putting on our apartment for rent, right? They're not set up as a business, they're not catered towards businesses or larger companies that have multiple properties. So we're limited in that. We have to create a new account, new Airbnb, account for each city. Additionally, it helps the AR team.

07:55 Erik Alvarez: In identifying specific deposits for specific properties. Because we have say, 35 different airbnb accounts. And logins or passwords. Maybe our shared within

08:10 Christian Sobkowski: Here. Yeah.

08:11 Erik Alvarez: Teams there might be turnover, right? We don't know we just want to track each. It's a easy way of attract of tracking each account based on deposits that we receive per city, right? If in New York, for instance, we see we haven't received deposits for three days. We know some things fishy, something's wrong there so that's kind of I know most of those are basically basically collection based.

08:37 Erik Alvarez: and saying like on the corporate accounting collection side where each vendor kind of has their own Individual. I guess budget code. On a Treasury level. All I want to see, is collections. What's your overall collections? Right. But I think we're doing this for our other AP AR accounting teams where it's easier for them to identify or create journal entries.

00:00 :

09:03 Christian Sobkowski: Yeah.

09:05 Erik Alvarez: I think that's

09:05 Christian Sobkowski: What?

09:06 Erik Alvarez: That's what it comes down to at the end. We're helping others. Treasury level, I agree. I want to see collections and it essentially be corporate versus otay right stripe, maybe stripe and booking, and all these others, but it would be maybe five. these others, but it would be maybe five.

09:23 Erik Alvarez: And that's in that sense, we're most of these more granular. I'll say, the more granular budget codes are for the other teams to help them report. Is there a more effective way of doing these budget coats so they can So they Report them or identify them rather? Yes.

09:42 Christian Sobkowski: Okay.

09:42 Erik Alvarez: Do we have the bandwidth to do that?

09:44 Christian Sobkowski: people just

09:45 Erik Alvarez: That's another question, right? I think the more

09:49 Christian Sobkowski: Fine.

09:49 Erik Alvarez: The more smaller I guess, the more

09:50 Christian Sobkowski: And I

09:51 Erik Alvarez: green or lean these teams are The more granular we have to get to help them. And that's I guess the unfortunate event that

09:59 Christian Sobkowski: Mean.

10:00 Erik Alvarez: has happened to us, right? Was it with the amount of turnover with smaller teams? Sometimes they're bigger, it's just A lot of it gets lost when they're

10:09 Christian Sobkowski: Just came.

10:10 Erik Alvarez: transitioning or when they're Training, the New People. The new. That they don't know.

10:17 Christian Sobkowski: the pictures goes ahead, as if

10:18 Erik Alvarez: So kind of makes it easier for us. Oh, let's just cut it to this specific one. It might just be used once and that's kind of like a pet peeve of mine. I don't want to create a one-off budget code.

10:30 Christian Sobkowski: I bet.

10:31 Erik Alvarez: It's and I think that's how most of these just stuck.

10:39 Christian Sobkowski: Yo, lead resonates so strongly with me right everything we're doing today. Right? I want to help you make your your stuff more lean. And you're teams your stakeholders were morally, right? That's so I think I helpful if I talk

10:54 Erik Alvarez: Exactly.

11:00 Christian Sobkowski: a bit about how well I've seen in the platform, Okay, and it's it's a bit of a give and take. And between us as you say, right? Like churchy stuff you're much better off and with lower granularity and then Would would you doing for the other team sets? Everything all that is reporting, right? It's about taking data out and

11:24 Erik Alvarez: Yep. Yep.

11:26 Christian Sobkowski: it to them in the the way that they can, Do their work with that. Is that right?

11:33 Erik Alvarez: Correct.

11:34 Christian Sobkowski: okay, so these detailed detail, let's

11:34 Erik Alvarez: No.

11:38 Christian Sobkowski: take the corp account stuff, for example. Um, right, you you I think you have where, I know you have corporate account. Bucket. And then you have a couple of Starting things split out. into like more detail level, I think, Silver Door is one that

11:59 Erik Alvarez: Yeah.

12:00 Christian Sobkowski: You, right? And it's that life in in a report somewhere for you at the moment.

12:07 Erik Alvarez: Yes.

12:07 Christian Sobkowski: Most budget codes.

12:09 Erik Alvarez: Yes, all of the

12:12 Christian Sobkowski: Tell me about.

12:15 Erik Alvarez: It is easier. Okay? So if we were to simply budget code all our different corporate account or corporate vendors, right? Just by one single budget code.

12:29 Christian Sobkowski: Yep.

12:30 Erik Alvarez: Would be up to the AR team to identify. If we push out the report just budget code corporate accounts, they would have to identify some sort of Their way of trying to identify specific. Deposits from different vendors, right? We are helping them in that. I don't know how they split up the work between the teams, right? And I think that's the other thing is I don't know if a specific individual is just looking at Otas or corporate vendors.

13:02 Erik Alvarez: Or In the UK versus another person. Looking I'm just in North America. so, the way that we've set them up is One report all granular corporate accounts and then they disperse it as necessary. They can filter by corporate vendor.

13:20 Christian Sobkowski: He?

13:24 Erik Alvarez: And disburse it as necessary or just. Rather than I think the other way they would filter is either by just doing a recon with amounts. We are. You're right in that we're doing it for others. Right. It's Salvador is active. I know there's a lot that are still active as well.

00:00 :

13:49 Christian Sobkowski: Yeah.

13:49 Erik Alvarez: But it helps the AR team. I easily identify.

13:53 Christian Sobkowski: Nice. Here's my. Use my suggestion. So, and The way. What would you do? What would you say if you're, you're getting the best of both worlds, where you are getting a Treasury view where you have sort of your collection split up maybe into like stripe at the end? Corp accounts.

14:24 Christian Sobkowski: And then you have the reporting where you're actually. Tagging the vendors as is going out to the AR team.

14:34 Erik Alvarez: Yeah, that that works for me like on a reporting level. If I see it or like in a dashboard or whatever it may be, if I just see

14:41 Christian Sobkowski: Yep.

14:42 Erik Alvarez: collections overall that's fine. And we have this hierarcho I've

14:44 Christian Sobkowski: Yep.

14:46 Erik Alvarez: created this hierarchy where Each of these corporate accounts are under a corporate account, hierarchy. Hierarch. The airbnb, all of these airbnb accounts, I don't care, the granularity, the detail. All I want is at the end of the day, I want to see Airbnb. Booking stripe and corporate collections, right? Just some of those are the four that I care about because eventually we need to track.

15:13 Erik Alvarez: How are we doing versus otas? How much are we collecting in corporate accounts on a weekly level? I don't honestly, I don't care who paid us last week. If Silvador paid us three times last week or they didn't pay us at all. That's not my job to follow up, but if the report is being sent to the individual teams with this level of detail, they can follow up and see they never paid us a thousand pounds last week or so forth.

00:00 :

15:37 Christian Sobkowski: Yeah.

15:38 Erik Alvarez: So yes, on a higher level, that's

15:39 Christian Sobkowski: Awesome.

15:41 Erik Alvarez: essentially what I want to see and I think that's where we're getting at.

15:45 Christian Sobkowski: Amazing. So, so I think, actually you use an answer my right, global global strategy, How do we tackle syncs is? It's very much you We group stuff, very, very close to what you currently have with your group coding level. That's driving. Internal dashboards into trashy, internal dashboards that's driving things such as forecasts.

16:16 Christian Sobkowski: Where right? You're It's hard to forecast, silver door, but it's pro. It's reasonable to forecast corporate accounts.

16:26 Erik Alvarez: Mm-hmm.

16:28 Christian Sobkowski: And and right seeing variances in corporate accounts, but see variances in silver or else make sense because it's just fluctuating so much. So,

16:36 Erik Alvarez: Right.

16:37 Christian Sobkowski: and so taking that and then making absolutely sure that obviously, right, the report needs to function assays where there needs to be an ocean of The collection support. Shows which of the which to vendors paid, what? In a given time frame? Okay.

16:59 Erik Alvarez: Yep.

17:02 Christian Sobkowski: Cool. Because eat any any I saw you use.

17:10 Gurjit Pannu: No, no, I think I'm good. I got my answer during the yep.

17:11 Christian Sobkowski: No, you're good.

17:14 Gurjit Pannu: the combo.

17:14 Christian Sobkowski: Cool. Amazing. Okay. Hey Erik. Then what I would suggest is for the rest of the call, we we dive into the actual UK house.

17:30 Erik Alvarez: Cool.

17:31 Christian Sobkowski: And do do a proper onboarding on them. And I'll switch over into something. Is that okay?

17:40 Erik Alvarez: Yeah yeah, let's go for it. Let's go for

17:43 Christian Sobkowski: And amazing. So look, I'll show you that you just in a second. But basically, right. We've we've been the data has been flowing through 29 categories of 158 our news, on your UK account. I'll show you how they split up. Basically over 92% of like notional mounts flowing through this year are covered by around 13 categories.

18:06 Christian Sobkowski: So this is a big ones on the UK cards.

18:09 Erik Alvarez: Mm-hmm.

18:12 Christian Sobkowski: And I'll show you the details now. Hang on, give me one sec. Can you see is this big enough for you to see?

18:30 Erik Alvarez: Yep, that works.

18:32 Christian Sobkowski: Yeah. Okay. So, look at the one sec. And this, this is a list. You, you send over. I I can quickly show you what what our platform gave out is. This, this is what's happened since since beginning of year.

18:58 Erik Alvarez: Mm-hmm.

18:59 Christian Sobkowski: In terms of right, absolute amount. per category, as well as percentage of total Volume going through the account. So, right, stripe, stripe. GB is close to 17% of your volume across. All three accounts. And yeah, you see here sort of after here, it really tailors off. Where, at least in the UK.

19:27 Christian Sobkowski: If if your solid or correct or C2. Living it really for your treasure activity. It makes zero difference. Almost.

19:38 Erik Alvarez: Yeah.

19:40 Christian Sobkowski: Does this look right? Does this? Surprising in any way.

19:48 Erik Alvarez: No. Everything looks. Um, no. I don't think anything surprises me.

19:58 Christian Sobkowski: Cool.

19:59 Erik Alvarez: yeah, I'm gonna say I think there's and maybe this is her. We can dive deeper just on a global level. I know you'll see like EC on eight and nine. Right.

20:15 Christian Sobkowski: Yep.

20:15 Erik Alvarez: These are just like transfers in and out. It's a way for us to identify is basically intercompany loan intercompany loans, right? And then on 13 on 11, 12 and 13.

20:23 Christian Sobkowski: Yep. Yep.

20:29 Erik Alvarez: Those are. These are all basically intercompany. Transactions right.

20:35 Christian Sobkowski: Yep.

20:36 Erik Alvarez: it's At first, we had set them up. How do I identify specific intercompany loan versus just settlements? I guess balance settlements or a different variation of it. I think it's just one of those things that we can probably get away on a global level and just say, It's in basically an intercompany transfer, right? These are just for me.

21:05 Erik Alvarez: Nobody else needs them. It does help. But is it worth? Clustering. I don't know, six. Six to eight budget codes to just have different variations of the same thing, right? Everything else makes sense, eu? No, I'm starting from the top right. EU e-com. That's use specifically for the AR team, and they've been very specific that they want to see that.

21:40 Erik Alvarez: Utility is another. That was just grandfathered in. That's probably I don't care. I don't forecast utilities I just I lump it into opex anyways.

21:53 Gurjit Pannu: Yeah, it's crazy. So like you see that that table to the top right? That's pie chart like YouTube. That's transaction counts and you see a lot of utilities right? But then you look at the notional amount. It's not that I mean it's still pretty significant but

22:05 Erik Alvarez: Yeah.

22:07 Gurjit Pannu: It's one of those things that we were talking about wait utility should actually be opex, but it's good to hear that. This is more of for your downstream teams.

22:14 Erik Alvarez: Yeah.

22:14 Gurjit Pannu: I want to play devil's advocate. A Christian might not be happy about this, but can we take a step back on the inner company stuff? Because I had some thoughts on that one, right? So like, I understand in a company settlements cost plus, those are typically like kind of kind of somewhat related.

22:28 Gurjit Pannu: It's just like balances do from to each other that you're kind of moving funding for.

22:32 Erik Alvarez: Exactly.

22:33 Gurjit Pannu: But in a company loans I kind of saw that during our discussion. I thought of it like in my Christian discussions where you at least from my experience, I would I would actually separate the two out because those are a bit different. Because as a Treasury, you are managing the loan portfolio.

22:49 Gurjit Pannu: Our intercoming alone portfolio and

22:51 Erik Alvarez: Yep.

22:51 Gurjit Pannu: would you would you would you be okay if it was all in her company? And does that affect how you think about and report and manage intercompany loans versus inner company settlements?

23:04 Erik Alvarez: I like I agree like it's it does help. If it's It helps I have a separate tracker as well, so I don't know how redundant also, it is like every time we we process, we do a loan.

23:19 Gurjit Pannu: Got it, cool.

23:22 Erik Alvarez: It's like all going and add it to

23:22 Gurjit Pannu: Hmm.

23:25 Erik Alvarez: separate tracker. So it's like is it double counting Do we need it Does it help? Yes, it adds value but I agree the engine company settlement versus cost plus. It's just a different. It's the same thing.

23:36 Gurjit Pannu: Got it.

23:37 Erik Alvarez: It's a, The cost plus, right?

23:41 Gurjit Pannu: Yeah, yeah. Okay.

23:41 Erik Alvarez: Is a form of settlement.

23:42 Gurjit Pannu: that, that then, I think goes in line with what Christian's saying is For the sake of forecasting. And visibility all of this is under intercom is totally fine. So long as in the future if we think about in a company loans there's a way to still identify those without it necessarily happen to be a specific category code.

24:01 Gurjit Pannu: You're happy with that.

24:03 Erik Alvarez: yeah, it's something I can think about because I know we do have

24:05 Gurjit Pannu: Yeah.

24:07 Erik Alvarez: Most of these loans and you see a lot is basically funding between the Finance Europe BB account.

24:15 Gurjit Pannu: Mmm.

24:16 Erik Alvarez: either both of them. It's or with under Europe.

24:21 Gurjit Pannu: Hmm, got it.

24:21 Erik Alvarez: So we're just yes it is a transfer between these two of these accounts, but it's kind of just funding through

24:29 Gurjit Pannu: Yeah.

24:29 Erik Alvarez: a loan.

24:29 Gurjit Pannu: Yeah, you're tracking it somewhere else anyway so Not much value being here Dashboard.

24:34 Erik Alvarez: I am, yeah.

24:36 Gurjit Pannu: Okay, cool.

24:37 Erik Alvarez: I am. But yes, in another world I guess I would agree that it's it. They're completely different from settlements.

24:44 Gurjit Pannu: Yeah. Okay, that makes sense when your world today so it's a it's good cool, thank you. So,

24:53 Erik Alvarez: Everything else? Yes, they're one-offs. I guess charge, the backs are used. The backs are. Airbnb text. Well, works, right? There's a lot of these are Very granular corporate accounts. And these are what you what is used by the other teams to identify.

25:15 Christian Sobkowski: Make sense. Hey, Erik.

25:17 Erik Alvarez: Yeah.

25:19 Christian Sobkowski: I don't want to we don't need to dwell on this too long and

25:22 Erik Alvarez: Yeah.

25:23 Christian Sobkowski: I, I would switch over here now.

25:26 Erik Alvarez: Cool.

25:27 Christian Sobkowski: I think we're right. We're seeing the same things. Sounds like we're all seeing the same activity. And what I would do now is, and I'm gonna filter this down this list down. This is the UK. Activity. Across across your, your budget codes, right? And you're seeing here the same, the same percentage as you earlier.

25:53 Christian Sobkowski: So,

25:54 Erik Alvarez: Yep.

25:56 Christian Sobkowski: and what I would love to do now is I Go through almost top to bottom across, you know, Big Four types. And have some of discussion to what khushi and you just talked about. We're seeing it to companies stuff around. You know, what would you expect in platform for reporting? Right? Where where are these relevant for external team reporting? Then, in terms of what's the Treasury use case.

26:26 Christian Sobkowski: I'll actually rename this into treasure use case. And then our Our quiz you and a few of these around some of the business contexts, we can identify them correctly. Correct. Okay.

26:40 Erik Alvarez: Yep. Yep.

26:45 Christian Sobkowski: Cool. So Let's Let's start with collections. First and foremost, If you're looking at it, that's around 34 34% of volume across the UK accounts. What? in terms of Treasury categories, would I would have heard from you, is that You would want something like airbnb, you would want Corp account.

27:21 Christian Sobkowski: You would want to add in. And you would want. Stripe.

27:28 Erik Alvarez: Mm-hmm.

27:29 Christian Sobkowski: And sort of the rest of these four kind of into that, in terms of treasure use case. Would that be accurate?

27:37 Erik Alvarez: The. Yeah, it's yeah, those would be the four. Main. Inflows that we would want to see. I guess on a higher level.

27:52 Christian Sobkowski: Yeah.

27:54 Erik Alvarez: Mm-hmm, everything and right, and you can see in the grouping code. It's like those are Already trying to be by higher.

28:02 Christian Sobkowski: Exactly. Yeah, spot the spot.

28:05 Erik Alvarez: That's exactly.

28:05 Christian Sobkowski: The spotter. So cool. So so what what you would right, what I'll take back to you to the team learners that we would like sort it into those four for a Treasury use case and those would be the category set we produce forecasts for for example.

28:24 Erik Alvarez: Mm-hmm. Yeah, forecasting level. That's what I would want to see. I don't, I don't even think. On a forecasting level. It would all of these would just fall under collections. I'm not forecasting airbnb, I'm not forecasting stripe.

28:39 Christian Sobkowski: Yeah.

28:40 Erik Alvarez: is useful on a reporting basis. Just because specific teams or even the C5, right? They want to see how are we trending versus Different Otas. If we're not collecting an audience. Is it really an OTA or a processor that we want? but,

29:01 Christian Sobkowski: I was about to say,

29:02 Erik Alvarez: You know, it's

29:03 Christian Sobkowski: So these these would write these four high-level categories says also some reporting benefit in those is what you're saying.

29:12 Erik Alvarez: Correct. Correct.

29:14 Christian Sobkowski: And I, I know, there's also different patterns in the forecast there that, right? Allow you to get just that bit more granular than a pure collections. Forecasting, especially Corp Account, will will have a very different seasonality slash pattern for you then. Airbnb and stripe. And

29:37 Erik Alvarez: Yeah, it's erotic. It's you wouldn't know how to It's you wouldn't know how to

29:42 Christian Sobkowski: Yeah.

29:42 Erik Alvarez: I don't know because it most of these for context is we send the corporate these vendors invoices, right? They can be net 30, but are they gonna pay within 30? Are they gonna pay within 15 or they gonna delay? It Did we send the invoice, right? Is it invoice? Correct, blah, right? All this good stuff.

30:02 Erik Alvarez: So yeah, it's that's why I just

30:04 Christian Sobkowski: Nice. Here.

30:04 Erik Alvarez: forecast on a collection level.

30:07 Christian Sobkowski: Yeah, I think would what we've seen as you can get a bit more granular where ultimately, right? The I think on a corp account. Yes. You want to assume like, almost a steady level? You don't want to forecasts peaks. Whereas on stripe, you do see peaks, seasonal, peaks. That if you forecast them, you are getting a granular, more accurate forecast.

00:00 :

30:32 Erik Alvarez: Mm-hmm.

30:34 Christian Sobkowski: Okay. In terms of reporting on all of these. You need them assets, is that right?

30:47 Erik Alvarez: Mmm. Yeah. I need the granularity. Well, I don't need it but they need to be reported For the other teams I can maybe do a Say a dummy test, where I take out these budget codes and send it to the teams and see how they react.

31:08 Gurjit Pannu: All of a sudden, everything is going to be perfect.

31:10 Christian Sobkowski: All right, it's

31:11 Erik Alvarez: No, it's like one of those things, right? You, you start sending emails. Nobody responds. And then you start sending weekly emails with some updates like You haven't heard anything for two months, like Oh, spending 30 minutes, out of my life, doing a report that nobody looks nobody cares about.

31:24 Erik Alvarez: No

31:26 Gurjit Pannu: We got to put in, we got to put in those trackers in your emails that show someone's opened your email or not. And after like two weeks, if that emails never been opened, you could just stop sending you. Know.

31:38 Erik Alvarez: Yeah. Yeah, but I've Yeah, I've actually gotten feedback that they don't want it a certain way. They want this specific budget code. Why didn't this budget coach show up and others? It's What I've seen is yes, they use. I'm currently.

32:01 Christian Sobkowski: Cool.

32:03 Erik Alvarez: Yeah.

32:06 Christian Sobkowski: And note that let's figure this out. Okay.

32:09 Erik Alvarez: Mm-hmm.

32:10 Christian Sobkowski: and I think actually, since we get enough examples for all of these so these are First, first time we ran the model on it. This is pretty pretty straightforward, unless you have some additional business context. I remember Airbnb was was kind of weird with with references But otherwise, I think all these are pretty straightforward, right?

32:37 Erik Alvarez: Yeah, I think they're fine. All these are already. They have some sort of description within the bank that shows what type

32:45 Christian Sobkowski: Yeah.

32:45 Erik Alvarez: of transaction or what? What they would be.

32:48 Christian Sobkowski: Cool. Okay let's let's move on into the little more interesting stuff and let's go into operating displacements. and this is, A large chunk of your activity 40% almost. On the UK accounts. I think. Reality straight for a treasure use Casey, the recommendation would be something like Opex is obvious payrolls, Obvious.

33:22 Christian Sobkowski: Very separate patterns. Rent is obvious The rest is not obvious to me. Where I think especially the differentiation between rent and prepaid rent and I think you have one more rent category and a global level.

33:40 Erik Alvarez: Mm-hmm.

33:41 Christian Sobkowski: maybe we can start, there is is

33:44 Gurjit Pannu: Deposit.

33:44 Christian Sobkowski: for? for any reporting any treasure use case that you can think of

33:53 Erik Alvarez: Prepaid rent is used in case we I guess again, in case we prepare rent, I don't know how to it's

34:06 Gurjit Pannu: Wow, that's a good one, man.

34:07 Christian Sobkowski: Hahaha.

34:08 Gurjit Pannu: Thanks for the inside.

34:08 Erik Alvarez: It's so smart.

34:09 Gurjit Pannu: weren't able to figure out.

34:09 Erik Alvarez: Yeah, I know it. I

34:12 Gurjit Pannu: I was thinking prepaid, rent met late, rent, man. But okay, this plant that you prepay. Got it, got it, got it. Got it got

34:18 Erik Alvarez: There's that's basically that's strictly for Treasury. There's no reporting base that sent out like how much we prayed. It's very rare, but when it does happen there might be questions as far as like for today, instance versus yesterday, right? If we would have paid Or prepaid a million yesterday then that falls into our Q2 versus, or I guess, Q3 versus Q4.

34:42 Erik Alvarez: Like Why is Q4 rent lower than we have to go back and see, it's not.

34:48 Gurjit Pannu: Okay.

34:50 Erik Alvarez: it's not used for anybody but sometimes we'll be questions. Later on, right? They'll be questions as far as wait. Why was Q4 rent higher last year than it was this year? It's like, then we go back and I'll be able to quickly say, Oh, we

35:04 Gurjit Pannu: Wow.

35:05 Erik Alvarez: prepaid a million and so forth.

35:07 Gurjit Pannu: Okay, a couple of questions for you in this one, right? So we talked about a couple weeks ago, around where the rent payments are being a bit staggered. Now, they're going away from the kind of first of the month approach because of what's going on at that's

35:16 Erik Alvarez: Current.

35:18 Gurjit Pannu: under. So, like so a prepayment, a rent prepayment would be you Sondra making a payment for rent out, like before the first or maybe like before the kind of agreed on typical. Settlements of rent. Essentially just painter. I want to say prayed early so prepaid, I get it. But like as in outside of the due date, earlier as and obviously earlier than the the due date or the Cycle Date.

35:49 Gurjit Pannu: Let's call it or like the when you typically do between the first and the fifth, for example, right is what

35:53 Erik Alvarez: Yep.

35:54 Gurjit Pannu: you ask that question? Okay, cool. And then so question number two is, How are you identifying that through rules of what's prepaid? Rent versus just regular rent.

36:05 Erik Alvarez: before, when we were on a normal cycle, where October rent was paid, October 1st, through the 10th,

36:13 Gurjit Pannu: Mm-hmm.

36:14 Erik Alvarez: And you saw that, oh, October 31st, there was a million run payment.

36:18 Gurjit Pannu: M.

36:19 Erik Alvarez: Okay, simple. It's manual.

36:21 Gurjit Pannu: Okay, got it. All right, so you go, you go in and

36:22 Erik Alvarez: There's no rules.

36:23 Gurjit Pannu: change it. There's not a rule that you've created a mapping rule.

36:25 Erik Alvarez: No.

36:26 Gurjit Pannu: It's rather you Okay. That's really interesting. I think that's really interesting for

36:30 Erik Alvarez: Now, it is more.

36:31 Gurjit Pannu: how we build the logic. Yeah, sorry.

36:33 Erik Alvarez: And now it is more difficult because as you mentioned, they're staggered, they're not all one day. So we paid rent yesterday that Was technically for September.

36:43 Gurjit Pannu: Mm-hmm.

36:44 Erik Alvarez: Right. in a Beautiful world. Prior to all of this yesterday. If I saw rent, go out yesterday, I knew for sure it was prepaid. But now it's

36:56 Gurjit Pannu: Well yeah.

36:58 Erik Alvarez: I'm not.

36:59 Gurjit Pannu: Got it.

36:59 Erik Alvarez: one of those things where

37:00 Gurjit Pannu: Got

37:02 Erik Alvarez: I have, if I know something, I'd have to go in and manually, change it

37:06 Gurjit Pannu: Got it. That's really interesting. I yeah, at least as much as I know, I'm not the tech savant here, but like if it was the first of the fifth we could have. We could I think we could have pretty accurately done. The PRE-RENT tagging for you by just telling the model any payment made outside of the first of the fifth that's rent.

37:25 Gurjit Pannu: Call it prepaid rent. Now I'm wondering still might be a

37:26 Erik Alvarez: Yep.

37:27 Gurjit Pannu: chance to do that. I think Christian, right. If you're able to kind of identify and maybe maybe, oh, overspeak getting into, like a magic ball thing, but I think maybe you're still as a way, but it's okay. So I think it's interesting, none.

37:39 Erik Alvarez: But I think that's that might happen

37:39 Gurjit Pannu: nonetheless.

37:41 Erik Alvarez: in the future where

37:42 Gurjit Pannu: Yeah.

37:44 Erik Alvarez: It would probably be rare to pay the current month, rent, from the 25th to the 30th, right? If we're paying from the 25th to 30th that would follow into the following months. Rent,

37:55 Gurjit Pannu: Yeah. Yeah.

37:57 Erik Alvarez: As far as it's just right now we're just trying to get payment plans and negative so it's just So

38:02 Gurjit Pannu: Yeah. Got it.

38:04 Erik Alvarez: Mmm, clustered.

38:05 Gurjit Pannu: And none of this stuff you're aware

38:06 Christian Sobkowski: Maybe.

38:06 Gurjit Pannu: of right? Like no one's, no one pings. You and says, Hey, by the way, we negotiated these five landlords rent to be now paid on the 15th or the 30th or the 27th or whatever. You're just, this is all reactive at this point from your perspective.

38:19 Erik Alvarez: It's, it's a little bit of both because we do have a Different reports and dashboards of what's being paid today or there's a forecast for the month, right? Because of how

38:31 Gurjit Pannu: Okay.

38:32 Erik Alvarez: Intense. We've gone with rent payments.

38:34 Gurjit Pannu: Okay.

38:34 Erik Alvarez: I don't know how that's gonna be sustainable or for that's gonna be going on for the next couple of months or this falls. Once we're in a better position or so, for just once everything, all the negotiations are done, if that just falls and yes, it would be reactive, as far as I'd see a million dollars, I don't know what it's for and I would have to go in and just

38:54 Gurjit Pannu: Got it.

38:55 Erik Alvarez: Reference, all these different reports.

38:59 Gurjit Pannu: Clear. Thanks.

39:03 Christian Sobkowski: Got. Now, do you want to quick behind the scenes? Look. On on rent. I can show you something real quick.

39:13 Erik Alvarez: Sure.

39:19 Christian Sobkowski: Can is this large enough?

39:22 Erik Alvarez: I can see.

39:23 Christian Sobkowski: Okay. So you are right. These are rent tag payments that you had That you've been you've been seeing through, right? These all these are obvious

39:37 Erik Alvarez: Mm-hmm.

39:39 Christian Sobkowski: Right. You you have stuff like this. When I'm looking at prepaid rent. There's exactly one that came through. On the UK accounts. Is this how how prepaid rent looks for you?

40:03 Erik Alvarez: In as far as description.

40:05 Christian Sobkowski: Yeah.

40:07 Erik Alvarez: It would. It would be different in each scenario. so in this instance, I manually added. If you go to the top, I manually added the property. So I added that for reference because I knew in the future. If someone comes back and asked me, if we paid any prepaid rent, then I can go.

40:31 Erik Alvarez: Yes, we paid this amount for this specific property. Why was that? Maybe we were negotiating with the landlord and he wanted his march rent before negotiating or something.

40:45 Christian Sobkowski: Gotcha.

40:46 Gurjit Pannu: but I think,

40:46 Erik Alvarez: Everything else? It's just

40:50 Gurjit Pannu: but you, you would have had, you

40:50 Erik Alvarez: Yeah.

40:52 Gurjit Pannu: would have had a budget code for this at rent though, right? So basically you would this would still be coded in kariba as rent. Originally, then you would see that it's prepaid and then go in and change it as from rent to prepaid rent, right? Or no, how do you identify it? Or

41:04 Erik Alvarez: When they're, when they're done as wires, it's a little bit more difficult.

41:09 Gurjit Pannu: Okay. Okay.

41:10 Erik Alvarez: We don't have separate like a rent versus an opex bank account, right? So I think that's why it makes it a

41:16 Gurjit Pannu: Yeah.

41:17 Erik Alvarez: little bit more difficult when they're done with batches that AP team processes. So they would put UK rent on the fit on the date.

41:25 Gurjit Pannu: Mm-hmm.

41:25 Erik Alvarez: That's how we identify rent. On, this is kind of like know-how. I know probably the beneficiary name was on the description, so I knew it was a landlord, but besides that the only way, I don't know if now we're getting into the weeds is, I would potentially give you a list of landlords, their vendor names if that pops up and if it's done by a wire, And if it's That's the only that's the only way I know as well.

41:54 Erik Alvarez: Just by the beneficiary, but it's

41:56 Gurjit Pannu: Got it.

41:57 Erik Alvarez: Not going to create a hundred budget codes for each landlord just a wired.

42:00 Gurjit Pannu: Mm-hmm.

42:04 Christian Sobkowski: Gotcha. and again for pure Treasury use case here Erik hears, Here's my suggestion I would suggest you code this as rent for the time being and then figuring out and reporting angle to how do we differentiate how do we differenti So, especially if it's A separate. It's paid on a different time or via different payment method.

42:35 Christian Sobkowski: You can get the rent forecast, which is right. Your regular forecast. But then in the reporting we build report for you that filters out rent payments made outside of typical hidences. And then you have a sort of prepaid rent report.

42:53 Erik Alvarez: Hmm.

42:53 Christian Sobkowski: With that with that work.

42:58 Erik Alvarez: I think so. I'm just thinking of the now I'm thinking on a global level, right as well.

43:04 Christian Sobkowski: Of course.

43:05 Erik Alvarez: Because I know you UK would

43:07 Christian Sobkowski: Globally.

43:08 Erik Alvarez: Global.

43:08 Christian Sobkowski: right?

43:10 Erik Alvarez: It would I don't know if there would be a window. But I'm taking I'm not thinking

43:14 Christian Sobkowski: Okay.

43:17 Erik Alvarez: about our current situation, I'm thinking further on normal business

43:21 Christian Sobkowski: Yeah.

43:22 Gurjit Pannu: Yep.

43:22 Christian Sobkowski: Okay.

43:23 Erik Alvarez: I'm I'm not sure if this is going to continue where we're still staggering payments as a business practice moving forward as well. I'm okay with rent.

43:35 Gurjit Pannu: Yeah.

43:35 Erik Alvarez: It's fine. I'm not.

43:35 Christian Sobkowski: Okay, let's it's it's not the end of the world. I'll keep moving this along for now and we can change this.

43:42 Erik Alvarez: To.

43:44 Christian Sobkowski: Let's let's go around for now. We'll change if things go wrong. Okay.

43:48 Gurjit Pannu: Yeah. Hey, it's just a thought real quick just saying this. So we can have it. Here is variance. Analysis. Should be able to capture a prepaid rent versus rent on this. On the on your

43:57 Christian Sobkowski: I would agree.

43:58 Gurjit Pannu: Okay. Yeah, cool.

43:59 Christian Sobkowski: Okay. Hey Utility, I think we already said you, you want to split out. You wanted an opex. op?

44:09 Erik Alvarez: Not just ended up X. Nobody I don't think anybody is like yeah, nobody

44:11 Christian Sobkowski: Nobody cares. Okay.

44:14 Erik Alvarez: Yeah, nobody has said anything. I'm I specifically need Utility. No. it's

44:19 Christian Sobkowski: All right, cool. Add tax. I think this is a lot of council tax in the UK. Is, is that right to split out for you?

44:30 Erik Alvarez: Yeah.

44:31 Christian Sobkowski: Or does that fall under Opex?

44:32 Erik Alvarez: No, we would need that split out for tax. That's how we do our because it's a usually, it's monthly. Or I think in the UK might be like the first week. but, It's um Yeah, we need we forecast tax as well on a separate line item. It

44:53 Christian Sobkowski: Got it, okay. Yeah, I think it's like, okay, this is good. Then we'll have council tax split up to tax. and let's for the last 10 minutes, go into A non-operating cash flows.

45:14 Erik Alvarez: Mm-hmm.

45:14 Christian Sobkowski: I think we can actually cover everything together. and because you already because you didn't you, or I talked about it, briefly around actually, the Treasury use case is Intercompanying for the majority of these excluding. Return, a separate bank fee and chargeback a separate. Everything else is into company flows, right?

45:42 Erik Alvarez: Correct. Yep.

45:46 Christian Sobkowski: Your your call do. Do you like them split out? Do you want? Want everything else into company? I find everything else into company reduces clutter. But if you see a use case, Obviously will accommodate.

46:04 Erik Alvarez: I don't see. Anything like I'm trying to also like Think back. I was like, when's the last time that I specifically looked for Something else. I know, I'm just thinking I'm thinking about the Clitor decluttering, but also, like the Inter Company loans, I know I have a separate sheet.

46:27 Erik Alvarez: She

46:28 Christian Sobkowski: Yeah.

46:30 Erik Alvarez: I don't know if anybody wants to see it. In a reporting sense. I know cost plus inner company settlement. And the transfer outs or transfer in those are all intercompany to me. We can We can We can group all of those.

46:53 Gurjit Pannu: Who does cost plus Erik, is that done by apeared? Do you guys do cost plus?

46:58 Erik Alvarez: We do those. They're treated the same way as just

46:59 Gurjit Pannu: Okay.

47:00 Erik Alvarez: in your company transaction.

47:02 Gurjit Pannu: Got it. You get it. You get an invoice cost. Less invoice and just settle it. And

47:06 Erik Alvarez: Or we get the work.

47:06 Gurjit Pannu: Or noise at all.

47:08 Erik Alvarez: report from tax because they're doing the transfer pricing and calculating all the Calculating everything else.

47:14 Gurjit Pannu: The markup, yeah.

47:16 Erik Alvarez: So, they would send us this is for

47:17 Gurjit Pannu: Got it, okay.

47:18 Erik Alvarez: the month. Yeah. But it's all it. Yeah, I think before it was more we were funding more when we were younger and we didn't have a lot of

47:32 Gurjit Pannu: Mm-hmm.

47:33 Erik Alvarez: money or I don't think we wouldn't have a lot of money. It's just probably had more money back then.

47:42 Gurjit Pannu: The money was for your back then, you mean? Yeah.

47:44 Erik Alvarez: yeah, when we were actually We had a lot of we weren't the markets weren't as mature as they were now, right? So, we were doing more cost plus and they were now anyways.

47:53 Gurjit Pannu: No.

47:55 Erik Alvarez: Yeah, I think those are fine. Let me think on the intercompany

47:57 Christian Sobkowski: Okay.

48:00 Erik Alvarez: alone because I know we also have like a loan repayment and stuff.

48:04 Christian Sobkowski: Yeah.

48:07 Erik Alvarez: Let me think on that one. For sure. Charge back in bank fees. We need return payments is kind of just Any opex that potentially was returned. I don't know if we need that to be honest. I don't know if it goes in a separate but let's,

48:28 Gurjit Pannu: If it's set in, if it sat in, if it sat in the OPEX code. So if you had OPEX you have operating disbursements

48:37 Erik Alvarez: Mm-hmm.

48:38 Gurjit Pannu: If a return kind of fell back in, it's a credit but it's set in the operating disbursements real line. Would that? Be okay? Or would you would you want to see them separately? And I would, I would imagine a return is, I guess not operating collection, but it's kind of weird, Right? Like returns are a bit interesting words, non-operating but it's from an operating payment.

00:00 :

49:01 Erik Alvarez: Correct.

49:01 Gurjit Pannu: I'll give you one train A quick creative thought is like say you had a hundred up, X payments and all of them got returned, then

49:07 Christian Sobkowski: Yeah.

49:08 Gurjit Pannu: Then you had to remake those hundred payments and then those got returned then you made them again. It looked like you had 300 or 900 in op-x payments. When technically you only had a hundred Right.

49:19 Erik Alvarez: Yep.

49:20 Gurjit Pannu: So to me with that logic, I typically like to put those under the operating disbursement category, because then it doesn't artificially inflate your Your numbers. The hard part is if if it's tracking the return, I think where it can be important is if you have a business that tends to have tons and tons of returns and it's pretty consistent.

49:41 Gurjit Pannu: Then then I understand the, the separate line for it, but I think it was like one transaction in the last year or two transactions that last year or something like that. I got such a small number that I would recommend returns actually sitting in your opex line. But that's just my suggestion.

00:00 :

49:58 Erik Alvarez: Yeah.

49:58 Gurjit Pannu: Your your call of course,

49:59 Christian Sobkowski: To.

49:59 Erik Alvarez: No, it makes that makes sense to me, but I think in the UK, I'm trying to think of anything else fell under returns.

50:07 Gurjit Pannu: Mmm.

50:09 Erik Alvarez: And because I agree it, at the end of the day, it's still, if there's a return, it has to be something on a payment that was done by AP. So it is technically and Opex related return.

50:25 Christian Sobkowski: chargeback, right?

50:27 Erik Alvarez: Yeah, that's

50:27 Christian Sobkowski: That. Yeah.

50:28 Erik Alvarez: monthly, you know?

50:31 Gurjit Pannu: Yeah, I would keep that as that.

50:31 Christian Sobkowski: Good. And I'll put Intercompany on all of these for now you just

50:39 Erik Alvarez: Yeah, let's do it.

50:41 Christian Sobkowski: You just let because you know, if

50:41 Erik Alvarez: Opening on

50:44 Christian Sobkowski: get more granyl, and again, if it's just reporting, we can figure that out in the reporting as well.

50:53 Erik Alvarez: Yeah, I'm thinking just just leave

50:53 Christian Sobkowski: the reporting as well. Okay.

50:55 Erik Alvarez: them as in your companies if anything else. Right, let's do the test on me now. Like as far as intercompany, if I don't use it then it worked. If I need it later on, then we can just we can split it out.

51:06 Christian Sobkowski: Then movement, of course. And fantastic. Hey, Erik any any closing thoughts? Otherwise I think this was It for the first run and we'll get in the up.

51:25 Erik Alvarez: Perfect, let me one thing, let me look into chargeback. charge. I know when I first started, it was charged back and returns were kind of the same. not the same thing but it was trying to identify between When customers? I guess cancel. So those were technically, charged backs and then they kind of shifted as chargebacks being like commissions that we pay to booking and all these other otas.

51:59 Erik Alvarez: Let me look into.

52:00 Christian Sobkowski: I was. Gonna say. So this is how your four chargebacks look. On the UK accounts.

52:14 Erik Alvarez: Yes, and I manually did those because those are specifically for booking.com. So, we're paying f** fees.

52:20 Christian Sobkowski: Okay.

52:24 Erik Alvarez: But I think within those fees, it's the chargebacks as well on top of the commission. So that's why it's like, The little company, but it's All in, I don't personally, I don't know if I like the chargeback term, so I think it's just changing the name. but,

52:45 Christian Sobkowski: Got it.

52:46 Erik Alvarez: It's but that's easy, right? It's like it's all that. It still would be under that same category, but it's just changing the name to something else more. Inclusive. Maybe. Some sort, I don't know if

52:57 Christian Sobkowski: What would you prefer?

52:58 Erik Alvarez: I don't know if I'd be, like, Ota commission or something, I don't know, but Because it's all inclusive it includes chargeback. It includes

53:07 Gurjit Pannu: We just put otay fees or something like that because it's Yeah, excited. It's it's your your fees that you owe booking plus any chargebacks that they had that you really have to reimburse them back for, right?

53:17 Erik Alvarez: Basically. Yeah. So it's like all inclusive.

53:19 Gurjit Pannu: No.

53:21 Erik Alvarez: Ev Yeah.

53:21 Christian Sobkowski: Yeah. Gotcha. I I have a feeling this. This is gonna be. I may come back on this after we had

53:34 Erik Alvarez: Okay.

53:34 Christian Sobkowski: run, run it. on figuring out how How we identify this, but we'll get there.

53:44 Erik Alvarez: Yeah, that one.

53:45 Christian Sobkowski: All these not for a follow-up.

53:49 Erik Alvarez: Yeah, I think we'll look. Because when they're paid out with AP or through NETSUITE, right through host to hosts and batches, it doesn't necessarily say what they're for. And that's been my biggest struggle in general is It doesn't say what it's for so I would have to go into netsuite.

54:11 Erik Alvarez: Look at the badge number. What is it for? I can easily put it up X. But then I would get questions basically saying, Hey, how much did we pay in booking last month or versus this month, right? Because something that We still want to keep track of how much we're paying these all ta.

54:27 Erik Alvarez: How much we're paying in OT fees, but yes, it's very meant. I still do it manual. it's

54:35 Christian Sobkowski: Understand.

54:36 Erik Alvarez: Yeah.

54:41 Christian Sobkowski: Okay.

54:42 Erik Alvarez: You know. Looks good though.

54:46 Christian Sobkowski: That's it from our side.

54:46 Erik Alvarez: Progress. Yeah.

54:51 Gurjit Pannu: Hey Christian. What can

54:51 Christian Sobkowski: Because you,

54:52 Gurjit Pannu: expect next? Like, when you do this, now, we're gonna run this categorization. I imagine we can do it on the cariba data to take out the budget codes and try to do it ourselves first. try to do it ourselves first.

55:02 Christian Sobkowski: I always got to say.

55:02 Gurjit Pannu: How do you, how do you want to? Yeah.

55:04 Christian Sobkowski: we're gonna do. Um, give it. I would say over the next two weeks, We're we have the dataflowing categorization, as if the career through, We're gonna run, run the budget code didn't exist, okay?

55:19 Erik Alvarez: Perfect.

55:19 Christian Sobkowski: so we're we're gonna do a bit of a blind test, which replicates if we received the data directly from HBC, And we're going to run the the categorization. And then what you can expect is a seeing it in the app, but be will pull a nice little report for you together together for you highlighting.

55:42 Christian Sobkowski: Any right, where where things matched? We're mismatched so right, I would And we're sings. expect, for example, the chargebacks might be tricky backs might

55:51 Erik Alvarez: Okay. Yeah.

55:52 Christian Sobkowski: And we will see all of those things where, okay, this is where things are confident. This is where things are not confident, and then we'll probably have one more go round of this and figure out. What worked with didn't and makes changes okay.

56:10 Erik Alvarez: Awesome. Yeah.

56:11 Christian Sobkowski: Cool.

56:12 Erik Alvarez: another meeting right now but

56:14 Christian Sobkowski: I won't I won't hold you Erik. Thank you.

56:16 Erik Alvarez: No, I a quick update though on the

56:16 Christian Sobkowski: So

56:20 Erik Alvarez: signers, they were able to do directors. So we sent off the

56:24 Gurjit Pannu: Nice.

56:24 Erik Alvarez: Two director signatories. I'll see. I haven't checked my emails but I'll see if they haven't responded. Then I'll follow up with them. but,

56:31 Gurjit Pannu: Awesome, man. That's, that's the best news right there. Hey thanks. Cool. Thanks for the push there. I'm gonna send you some messages on slack. Have some updates for you as well as I'm asks, but I'll put this on slack

56:40 Erik Alvarez: Okay.

56:40 Gurjit Pannu: for you.

56:41 Erik Alvarez: Let me know, but Apprecially you all.

56:42 Gurjit Pannu: Awesome.

56:43 Erik Alvarez: Thank you.

56:43 Gurjit Pannu: All right.

56:43 Erik Alvarez: So.

56:43 Gurjit Pannu: Thanks man.

56:43 Christian Sobkowski: I'd like one.

56:44 Gurjit Pannu: Yeah.

56:44 Christian Sobkowski: Yeah.